# Major mistakes made, how to remedy?



## Glassparakeet (10 mo ago)

Hello everyone, Until I found this forum, the information that I found on the Internet lead me to make some big mistakes with our two new baby parakeets.

I am so grateful for this forum. But I still need some advice. I’m losing sleep over the state of our new budgies.

First off, I’m not animal illiterate. I am a dog groomer, I was a veterinary technician but we did not see birds at the clinic I worked at. I have had horses cows goats chickens cats dogs and fish my entire life. I have never had birds. I always go above and beyond for my animals. That is why I am stressing out about these parakeets.

We got them from a lady who bred in her house. She is not a breeder. She did not give me much advice and even said that I could handle the birds before putting them in the cage when we got home.

I was also under the impression that they needed flight time. We also bought a cage that I could not clean by sliding the tray out. So in the first week that I have had these birds, I have grabbed them and held them multiple times. I have young children who run by the cage and startle them. I have since moved the cage, trying to start the two week period with peace.

They still seem extremely stressed. They do not vocalize when we are in the house except for the angry or stressed squawk. Evidently they are only eight weeks old.

My question is, is all hope lost? I can tell you that we definitely traumatized them out of ignorance.

I cannot make my children be quiet and calm all the time. They try their best but they are young. Is our house ever going to be a place where these birds will settle in and get used to us? Does anyone have any advice for me? Can someone give me a timeline of how long I could expect these birds to take to trust us seeing as we have burned all of our bridges in the first week?
























Here are the pictures. I apologize for the long post but would be deeply deeply grateful to anyone who can respond with some compassion. I am literally willing to do anything to give these guys a better life and to gain their trust.

Emilie


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## Moveren (10 mo ago)

Sure they are not stressed. Having fun instead. Budgies love noise.


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## srirachaseahawk (Sep 5, 2021)

Welcome to TalkBudgies!

You haven't done anything that can't be undone.
You have two lovely _babies. _Going forward, please don't grab them  You should never grab at a bird unless it is medically necessary for some reason. Below are some steps to get you started with the taming process so that they choose to be with you.

Flight time will come in time, right now the focus should be on acclimating them to their new environment.

What kind of diet do you have them on?
What are the dimensions of the cage?

You just need to move at the pace that your animal is comfortable with.
It sounds like you got them from someone who didn't socialize their animals; your birds are going to need a couple of quiet weeks to settle in. They can seem “tame” at first, but this is likely just because they are frightened and submissive.

Start by resting your hand on the outside of the cage for 5-10 minutes a few times a day. Talk to them as you do this, in a quiet and steady voice. Read something to them if you like 

After a week or two of this, you can move to just placing your hand "in" the cage. You can use their behavior as a judge on this one. If they actively retreat from your hand, even when it’s on the outside of the cage; they aren’t ready for you to go to the next step. Once they start to essentially “ignore” your hand, then you can move on.
The next step is to put your hand in the cage. Don't touch them, go near them or even move. Just rest it there for the same 5-10 minutes a few times a day and continue with the quiet, steady speech.

Your birds will eventually begin to acclimate to you and slowly move up to investigating your hand. Then you can work on treat placement in the hand to see if you can then lure them to step on it to eat from it (again without moving).

And then you go from there.









This could take weeks or even months of work and is entirely up to the bird. You may get lucky and have a very outgoing animal that tames in a short period of time, or you may have a more timid creature on your hand that requires a lot more from you.

Birds require far more patience with training than dogs and cats do. They all know instinctively that they are "prey items" and we are basically asking them to ignore that natural response when confronted by a larger predator (you).

You can also use their voice as a measure of their comfort.
A whistling/chirping budgie is not a scared budgie 









Please take a look at the "stickies" posted in each of the topic areas for a wealth of knowledge.
Here are a few to get you started!


Breeders over Pet Stores

Is My Bird Healthy?
Yes, Your Bird Needs to See a Vet

Please Don’t Breed Your Birds
Coffee & Toast, Hold the Eggs

Clicker Training
Positive Reinforcement

Safe Foods


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## Cody (Sep 5, 2013)

Your new babies are adorable, have you named them yet? Srirachasehawk has given you great info to begin. It appears that the cage is some sort of dome shaped cage, that is not the best type of cage for a budgie, a large rectangular cage would be best. Essentials to a Great Cage Young children are so anxious to be friends with an animal they often do not understand that their actions are making things worse, it would be best to find a way to make them understand that if they persist with loud noises and fast actions, that the birds will not be able to be their friends because they will always be afraid. Please do not let your children stick their fingers in the cage, bang on the cage or throw things at it, these are things that very young children may do out of frustration and will be very emotionally damaging to the birds.


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## Glassparakeet (10 mo ago)

Thank you both for your replies! My children do not bang the cage but they are just so active. They yell, scream, laugh. I try to have them go to another room than the birds but they do not.

I have removed the birds from the dome cage. (Did it without grabbing them!!!) they are now in a large rectangular cage that is at least 20” long. I will try to get a bigger one next week.

Their names are Elfy and Zazz Pop. Are they boys or girls? Can anyone tell at this age?

I really think they are so so scared. I just wonder if they’ll ever get used to us. But I have been doing what this forum recommends. I have been making chops for them with broccoli and millet or strawberry and spinach and millet. They also have Kaytees mixed with Roudybush pellets that the lady I got them from recommended but I have a bag of Dr Harvey’s in myChewy cart unless someone has a better recommendation.

our house is small enough with an open floor plan that I cannot truly separate them from my kids. I’ll have to see what’s best. Is it ok to move the cage from one room To the next depending on where the least chaosor is it better to keep them where they are?

thank you thank you
Emilie



srirachaseahawk said:


> Welcome to TalkBudgies!
> 
> You haven't done anything that can't be undone.
> You have two lovely _babies. _Going forward, please don't grab them  You should never grab at a bird unless it is medically necessary for some reason. Below are some steps to get you started with the taming process so that they choose to be with you.
> ...


They are absolutely silent when we are in the house 😢 when we go to another room I hear them fight at eachother. Like they are stressed and taking it out on their pal?


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## srirachaseahawk (Sep 5, 2021)

Glassparakeet said:


> They are absolutely silent when we are in the house 😢 when we go to another room I hear them fight at eachother. Like they are stressed and taking it out on their pal?


Squawking and squabbling is normal.
“Fighting” is if they are physically on each other trying to hurt each other. If that’s happening, they need to be separated. If they are just bickering, that should be ok, but keep an eye on it to make sure it doesn’t get worse.


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## FaeryBee (May 9, 2011)

*Your budgies are extremely young. Certainly no more than 8 weeks old. They are adorable.

Elfy and Zazz Pop are quiet when you are home because they are terrified with all the noise and commotion.
Make sure the cage is against a wall and consider covering the top and three sides of the cage to help the budgies feel more secure.
It is fine to move the cage from room to room. Doing so when the budgies are young will help them get used to it.

How old are your children?

The pictures you posted are not the best for determining gender but it looks as though you have a male and female.
If you could please post clear, in focus, full sized pictures taken in natural light (no flash and no direct sunlight) of each budgies' cere, that will make it possible to make a more accurate determination of their gender.

If you do, indeed, have a male and female you will need to ensure you do everything necessary to prevent breeding.*

*A Heartfelt Plea to All Members*
*Tips For Discouraging Breeding*
*Before You Ever Consider Breeding Your Budgies*
*Guidance for Breeding Advice Threads*


*The purpose of this forum is to promote the BEST PRACTICES in the care of budgies for their optimal Health and Well-Being*
*Locating an Avian Veterinarian*

*A Healthy Diet for your Budgie*
*Quality Seed Mix*
*CuttleBones, Mineral Blocks and Manu Clay Roses*
*Safe Foods for Budgies*
*The Truth about GRIT*

*Please take the time to read through the Site Guidelines, the FAQs, the Budgie Articles and all of the Stickies located at the top of each section of the forum.*

*Truly, the very BEST advice anyone can offer you is to take the time to read ALL of the stickies throughout the various Talk Budgie forums as well as the Budgie Articles we have posted.
(Stickies are threads “stuck” at the top of each forum sub-section)
These are great resources for Talk Budgie members and have a wealth of reliable information which will assist you to learn the best practices in caring for your budgies for their optimal health and well-being.*

*SITE GUIDELINES*
*Posting on the Forums*
*Let's Talk Budgies!*
*FAQ*
*Articles*
*Be Prepared for Veterinary Care Expense*
*Avian First Aid*
*Quarantine IS Necessary!*
*Cage sizes.*
*Essentials to a Great Cage*
*Dangers to Pet Birds*
*Resource Directory*


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## StarlingWings (Mar 15, 2013)

Hello and welcome to the forums, 

You've been given great information and advice above and I agree completely. More photos would be helpful, but I'm positive you have a male and a female. FaeryBee's advice above is spot on with regards to discouraging breeding. 

Additionally you've received many other links and articles; be sure to read these to stay updated on the best of budgie care practices. 

If you have any questions after reading through the above links, please be sure to ask as we'd love to help. 

Please keep us updated on how your budgies are doing. 

Best wishes!


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## Glassparakeet (10 mo ago)

FaeryBee said:


> *Your budgies are extremely young. Certainly no more than 8 weeks old. They are adorable.
> 
> Elfy and Zazz Pop are quiet when you are home because they are terrified with all the noise and commotion.
> Make sure the cage is against a wall and consider covering the top and three sides of the cage to help the budgies feel more secure.
> ...


Thank you very much! I have read through many of the stickies, I have also read many of your comments to other users. You are very helpful. My children are four and five. I will send better pictures of the two birds when I get home. Is it really possible to tell gender at this age? They have started chirping a little bit while we are home. My five-year-old goes and sits by their cage and talk to them very sweetly all the time. They actually were chirping back to her the other day. They startle really easily unless we are sitting by the kids for quite some time.


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## StarlingWings (Mar 15, 2013)

Glassparakeet said:


> Is it really possible to tell gender at this age? They have started chirping a little bit while we are home. My five-year-old goes and sits by their cage and talk to them very sweetly all the time.


It is definitely possible. Young males have purplish or pink ceres with no white, while females have whitish or pale blue ceres; they may also have pinkish ceres but with rings around the nostrils. I'm glad your oldest is talking to the budgies in a calm way, that's great. Keep up the good work.


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## wwmills (Sep 7, 2020)

Emilie, you are a great bird parent! Your love for your featherbabies shines through your post.
I cannot add to the great advise above except to say patience and love will win.


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## Glassparakeet (10 mo ago)

More pictures:

















The doctor Harvey’s food came yesterday. I filled up their bowl about a quarter of the way full so that they don’t waste this expensive food. It looks like the eat a little last night but not much. Every day I’ve been giving them chopped up veggies and fruit but they don’t touch it. One day when I put hard-boiled egg in with broccoli they did eat some of that.

I am going to read the articles on having a male and female because it appears that that is what I have. I definitely do not want babies. The female is the more calm one, the male is smaller and the panicked one.

It seems that all they really really like to eat is me it. Should I give them a stick of millet every day? I didn’t give them any today because I want them to eat the Dr. Harvey’s. I also thought maybe Millard could be used only for teaming. Unless you think it’s an important part of their diet.

Thank you all for your loving supportive comments. It has really helped me be more confident.

Emilie


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## Cody (Sep 5, 2013)

Do you still have some of the food that was given to you by the woman you got them from? If so, it would be best to gradually begin to incorporate the new food into the diet, a sudden change can produce digestive upsets. 1 1/2 -2 teaspoons of seed per bird a day is enough and you can split that into am and pm feedings and you can leave pellets out all the time. I would not feed a entire spray of millet, this is too much, try putting just a couple of little balls of the millet in with the Dr. Harvey's and see if that will help them eat the new seed mix. Don't give up on the veggies, give fruit sparingly or not at all as there is too much sugar in it. You will have to wait and see how things play out with a mixed gender pair, I have one pair, that I have never in 8 years had any mating issues with and another pair that I had to separate, take a look at this article for a bit of info on unwanted eggs When We Don't Want Eggs!


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## StarlingWings (Mar 15, 2013)

I agree with the above, another thing is that millet should be used only as a treat or as Cody suggest to get them to initially to try new foods as it is very high in fat and low in nutrients compared to their normal seed as well as pellets. Link provided above is great too. Definitely a boy and a girl.


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## Glassparakeet (10 mo ago)

Hello All!!

I just bought them an ENORMOUS flight cage on Amazon. See picture. It came highly recommended by some real parakeet lovers and experts. 1/2” bar spacing. Should I put them in it immediately or wait until they are a bit more tame? They have really acclimated well so far. They chirp when we are around (especially the female) the male is the one who panics occasionally still when I put my hand in the cage to change water and food.

I feed the Dr Harvey’s morning and night- about 2tsp each serving. They LOVE broccoli but that’s it for veggies. I bought bok Choy and jalapeño and have quinoa and peppers to make a chop that I found recipe for- I doubt they will touch it. They don’t like anything!! I tried fresh parsely, all kinds of lettuce, celery, etc.

Anyways, My main question is should I put them in the cage right away? I will follow the guidelines to avoid breeding, but I worry about separating them entirely. They seem to love to groom eachothers heads! I have a neighbor who has 6 parakeets to give away (not related to the original lady). Should I adopt one or two of these to pair with my babies (after quarantine?) like a female to put with my female and a male to put with my male? Hers are crazy and untame- they are in large cages and they are SO loud compared to ours. 

Thank you for all of your support!!!!!


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## srirachaseahawk (Sep 5, 2021)

Now that's a cage!

I would not move them yourself, but let them "move in". 

If you can work it so that the doors of the cages are lined up with each other, see if they will go from their current cage to the new one. It helps if you can start moving toys, perches and the food over to the new cage. It may take a few hours, but they should move in.

This will work best if there are no gaps for them to get loose through, especially if you haven't given them any flight-time yet.

I would *not *grab them or try to manually move them. They need to do it on their own, or they will just get stressed out.


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## Glassparakeet (10 mo ago)

Great idea, I will move them this way. I can attach their current cage to the side of this giagantiv one with zip ties. Do you think we will lose all hope of having tame birds if we give them such a large condo? I prefer they are happy to tame. I also wish I had two birds of the same sex 😤


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## Cody (Sep 5, 2013)

I have that cage in another color, I originally got it for my Linnies but they did not use the entire cage so I moved them to another cage. It's nice that it has a center divider in case you need to separate birds.


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## FaeryBee (May 9, 2011)

Y*ou will not lose all hope of having tame birds in that cage. Just realize that the taming process isn't something you can rush.

Taming and Bonding is all about helping your budgies learn to trust you and it takes a great deal of time and patience on your part.
You should never grab your budgies or force them to be touched.
To bond with your budgies, you need to build their trust in you.
They will have to learn over time that you will not hurt them, grab them and try to force them to allow you to hold them.

To build your birds’ trust, sit by their cage and read, talk or sing quietly to them for a period of at least 10-15 minutes, 3 or 4 times day. After about a week, rest your hand on the outside of the cage when you talk to them so they will learn that your hand is safe and will not hurt them. 

After a week of resting your hand on the outside of the cage, rest your hand inside the cage when you talk.
Don’t make sudden moves, don’t try to touch them.
Let their get used to the idea that the hand is now in their safe place and not harming them.

After 2 weeks, begin moving your hand slowly toward your bird. If they become agitated, stop moving your hand and just hold very still until they calm down. When they are comfortable with your hand near them, you can offer them a bit of millet or a few seeds.

Always work at your birds’ pace.
Move slowly and talk reassuringly and calmly to their whenever you interact with them.

Bonding means allowing your budgie to choose to be with you.
*


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## Glassparakeet (10 mo ago)

I am sure you guys are not going to be surprised, but we had a major breakthrough last night! Both my five-year-old daughter and I fed them millet at different times and both birds hopped onto our hands to eat!!!!! Hooray!!! I have been carrying their kids around with us in the house and they seem to like to be with us. When we get the bigger cage, I am sad because we won’t be able to do this.


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## FaeryBee (May 9, 2011)

*When you get a bigger cage and the budgies are more tame, you will be able to put them in the smaller cage and carry them around the house.
They will enjoy having the adventures!*


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