# Buddy went from not eating or drinking to hyperactive constant eating



## Kujen (Jun 9, 2007)

My budgie Buddy has been really sick lately. I noticed Friday that he was not singing and sat on his perched fluffed up a lot, he wasn’t eating or drinking much. I took him to an emergency vet on Saturday, and was prescribed Baytril and Metacam. They said he was very thin, which is unusual for a bird on a seed diet. I refused to let them do a blood test or X-ray because he is not finger tamed and very easily frightened. He spent the rest of the night petrified and clinging onto the side of the cage.

I’ve been giving him the antibiotic and anti inflammatory once a day. I also gave him a little bit of water while feeding his medication to him. I regret doing that now because it’s really dangerous and I hope he didnt aspirate. I was so concerned about him being dehydrated. His eyes looked sunken in and weak. He stopped eating and drinking almost completely and looked so weak, staying on his favorite perch. I thought he was going to die within days, due to not eating or drinking.

Monday he started to eat again, but he ate mostly the pellets in his seed mix, whereas he used to ignore them entirely.

Anyway, today he is hyperactive, wings shaking, and crawling all over the cage bars (he didn’t usually do this to begin with). His eyes are brighter. He has wet feathers on the sides and under his beak, but I don’t know if it’s from drinking water, the meds I give him dripping down, or if he’s been vomiting (I don’t see any regurgitated seeds). He is eating constantly. He is chirping a bit, but his voice sounds weak. His poop is still liquids, often it’s like clear straight urine, other times a bit green. He is pooping very often but no solids. There are occasional gurgling noises that I first noticed after giving him the meds yesterday. I am concerned it may be a sign of fluid getting into his lungs, or a yeast infection in his crop from the use of antibiotics. The vet didn’t mention to use probiotics or anything like that.

I have another vet exam with an avian and exotic vet scheduled for tomorrow. I was considering canceling it because he seems so much better. But the extreme eating, pooping straight liquid, and gurgling noises are a concern to me now. Should I still take him? Should I let them do all of the diagnostic tests? Again, he is a very easily frightened bird so I don’t really want to subject him to that stressful environment if I don’t have to. I am also concerned about the meloxicam since I heard it can be bad for their kidneys, should I stop giving him that?

Edit: he just pooped again and it was a more solid form, but still wet green with clear urine and no white urates.

Edit 2: the droppings with poo in them seem rare now as he’s just releasing clear liquid very often, like every 10 mins, with no feces or urates.


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## Cody (Sep 5, 2013)

Sorry Buddy is ill, I would not cancel the appointment you have tomorrow. Did the ER vet do any test on the droppings? The 2 meds you are giving are very commonly used, I actually have a bird on the same thing currently for a GI tract issue. Don't stop the meds unless the vet stops them. The Metacam is an anti-inflammatory and also has a pain relieving aspect to it, I have had birds on it for extended periods of time will no ill effects to the kidneys. When you see the vet tomorrow ask about doing a gram stain on the droppings and maybe a mouth/crop swab, all that is needed for the test on the dropping is a fresh one and the crop swab is not too invasive, the vet will just swab the mouth and smear it on a slide. Since Buddy has been on the Baytril the vet may say that doing the tests now will not give an accurate picture of what the problem is but an antibiotic will only effect bacteria so if there is anything else causing the problem it may show up. If Buddy is dehydrated the vet can give him some fluids under the skin. You can try offering him some Pedialyte in addition to his water and that will help hydrate him.


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## Kujen (Jun 9, 2007)

The ER vet did not do any test on the droppings. They basically said that they do treat birds, but they are ER vets and I’d have to go to the avian certified vet for things like that. Although she did suggest the blood test and x-ray which I declined.

Right now I don’t know if he is still dehydrated. He’s actually drinking and eating a lot and he’s now having clear water like poops very often, like every 10 mins it seems. Most of the time they have nothing to them but clear liquid urine, without any feces or urates. He looks quiet restless and shivering a lot, very active when he’s not on his perch. Still fluffed up.


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## Cody (Sep 5, 2013)

Buddy does need to be seen by an avian vet so please keep that appointment. Are you sure that he is actually eating and not just playing with the food? If he is eating you should see the passage of some fecal material. When birds are ill they spend a great deal of energy to keep warm so it is important that you keep him as warm as possible, cover the cage on 3 sides if that will help to keep the cage area warm. Being fluffed up is a sign that he is not feeling well so even though you have seen him being active he is not feeling normal. When you see the green in the droppings is it in the fecal portion or the urate portion?


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## Kujen (Jun 9, 2007)

His poo has changed so many times over the past day or two it’s hard to keep up. The green was initially the fecal portion, very wet and no solids, while the urate was kind of off white maybe a little greenish stained by his diarrhea. The urate looked kind of curdled spread out bits and not solid like it used to be. At one point the poo was like dark green, almost black, pudding consistency. Then sometimes watery light green with very little urates spread out over it. Earlier today, straight urine clear liquid. Then the occasional dark color firmer poo with more normal looking urate, but small. Now i see more normal firm poo with white urates but with undigested seed in it. He is still eating constantly. He downed half of a millet spray. Very, very active but occasionally sits with his head tucked in. He’s still not singing but does a quiet little contact call. I have been keeping a heater in the room, the temps vary around 80-85F.

I am wondering if the meds have really messed up his digestive system. Also concerned about a possible secondary yeast infection. Maybe the little gurgling sound was from his crop?


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## Cody (Sep 5, 2013)

One of the things that can cause undigested seed in the droppings is Avian Gastric Yeast, there are other things as well but please make sure you address this with the vet as this is not something that will go away on its own and needs immediate treatment if the organism is found. I don't mean to alarm you but based on what you have described I just want to make sure that you address all possible issues. Please also ask the vet about possible liver issues based on the green color you are seeing and sometimes if there is bleeding in the upper GI tract you can see very black tar like droppings. Please keep us updated after you have seen the vet.


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## FaeryBee (May 9, 2011)

*I agree with Cody 100%. It is critical that you take Buddy into the Avian Vet and address every issue that you've noticed.

The Avian Physical Examination

Understanding Avian Laboratory Tests*


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## Kujen (Jun 9, 2007)

Buddy was getting better, eating, even singing a bit. His poops were looking better. I took him to the avian vet Thursday and everything went fine. But now today he is vomiting seeds and has undigested seeds in all his poop. I took him back to the animal ER today and they didn’t even acknowledge the undigested seed in the poop. The ER vet told me to stop the Baytril and metacam and prescribed metoclopramide three times a day to stop the vomiting. Which is so stressful to catch him. I’ve tried to get them to test his poop for yeast but they say I have to go back to the specialist for that next week. This is so upsetting. He’s back to looking ill and fluffed up and not eating again. What can I do? ☹


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## Cody (Sep 5, 2013)

What do you mean by everything went fine, were there any tests done? It is critical that the droppings get tested for bacteria, parasites and fungal issues i.e. Avian Gastric Yeast. This test is not anything unusual and in my opinion should have been done already. By not having any tests done your bird cannot get the correct treatment. Please contact the avian vet and explain the symptoms and ask to be seen right away. Has he stopped vomiting with the Metoclopramide, see if he will eat some spray millet, at this point you need to get nourishment in him and keep him hydrated. You can get some Pedialyte and soak some millet in it and offer it to Buddy. If you cannot get Pedialyte there is a recipe in this link.
https://www.talkbudgies.com/your-bu...uardian-angel-pedialyte-pedialyte-recipe.html


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## Kujen (Jun 9, 2007)

No tests were done, you’re right. I really wish I had pushed for that. The avian vet even mentioned looking at the poop himself but he never actually took a sample. I guess he thought he looked and acted alright, although he’s thin. He wanted me to continue the Baytril and metacam (where the ER vet has just discontinued those). Now it will be yet another trip to the avian vet. But I can’t do anything til Monday.

Right now he is switching between being hyperactive and climbing all over the cage in weird ways, scratching, preening, and shaking his tail a lot, eating, chirping, to sitting on his perch looking sick. I have started to hear that gurgling noise again today too. There is still undigested seed in his poop but he does not seem to be vomiting. I question whether it is right to stop the antibiotic and metacam when we were only half way through, but that’s what the vet said. I really don’t want to grab him 3 times a day for the metoclopramide - I wonder if it is still necessary if he is not vomiting since this morning?

What do you think of how he’s climbing all over the cage? It’s really strange


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## Cody (Sep 5, 2013)

Very common for a sick bird to look fine when at the vet, don't be fooled by it. The vet may have thought that the meds were producing side effects and if the meds are stopped and the odd behavior stops than it can be assumed that the meds had something to do with it.
Sometimes a side effect of metoclopramide can be hyperactivity but Buddy was not taking that when the hyperactivity started. The shaking of the tail may be due to the condition of the droppings, is it a shaking as if he is trying to get something lose?


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## Kujen (Jun 9, 2007)

Well the avian vet did say Buddy was quite thin like he can’t keep the weight on. It was the ER vet who stopped the meds, thinking they were causing the vomiting. I’m not sure I believe it, because he has been on them for a week, why would that just now happen? I hope stopping the antibiotics half way won’t be harmful.

I only saw the vomiting that morning, I haven’t seen it since, however there is definitely still undigested seed in his droppings (the ER vet didn’t believe me). I’m quite worried that the antibiotics caused a secondary yeast infection. I mentioned that at the ER but they wouldn’t test for it. The ER vet recommended taking him back to the avian vet for diagnostic tests such as crop wash for trichomonas, barium contrast to check for foreign bodies and proventriculutis, and pharyngeal swabs looking for spirochetes. All I wanted was for someone to examine his droppings...He’s a fragile and easily scared little guy and I don’t want them to do anything too aggressive.


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## Cody (Sep 5, 2013)

The fact that Buddy is too thin and cannot keep weight on, the vomiting and the droppings with the seed in them are all things that are seen with AGY. In my opinion the suggestion of those tests is ok but only after the most basic test on the droppings has been done. I think you are going to have to insist that a Gram stain test be done on the droppings, that will reveal the bacteria population and the percentage of gram positive to gram negative type of bacteria, it is the gram negative % that is pathogenic. When looking at the slide under the microscope if there are any abnormalities it will be noted. To see the organism that is associated with AGY (Avian Gastric Yeast) it has to be actively shed, sometimes it is not but based on other symptoms an experienced avian vet will be able to ascertain whether or not AGY is suspect. If the test on the droppings does not reveal anything then I would expect the next test to be a crop/throat swab, and if that does not reveal anything, then it would be appropriate to move on to the other tests suggested. A barium x-ray can be very revealing but with my own birds I would not progress to that until the basic tests had been done, unless upon physical examination the vet could feel something wrong and needed the x-ray at that point to further diagnosis. Put white paper towels at the bottom of the cage for 24 hours and take that to the vet so he/she can see 24 hours worth of droppings, a fresh one is needed for testing but seeing what passes in a 24 hour period can be helpful.


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## lbeckman (Jun 26, 2016)

Have you continued the medicines from last week or discontinued them as the ER doctor suggested? (All considered, I would continue them, but others here are more experienced.)

You might consider moving Buddy to a smaller cage and/or remove some of what is in the cage so that it is easier to catch him. I have had to do this many times with untamed birds (I foster for a rescue) and it helps make everything less stressful. It helps to even just remove things from the lower part of the cage. It also helps to darken the room if possible. (I sometimes cover a small cage and take it into a closet or interior bathroom and keep the light dim.) I use a lightweight piece of cotton fabric to catch them rather than a towel so that they don't catch their toes in the fabric. 

Also, I think you were correct to decline a blood test and X-ray at the ER vet. The closest I've come to that situation was at my regular vet office on a weekend. The was only one vet and she was not an avian vet, though she had some experience with birds and other exotics. When she mentioned the possibility of doing a blood test, I (politely, really) asked her if she was sure she could draw the blood without killing my bird. She ended up not doing it.  Also, for an X-ray to be useful, I'm pretty sure they need to sedate the bird, which is also potentially dangerous. None of the avian vets I have used draw blood on a budgie without a very good reason; they have never suggested it with any of my budgies, even when they were ill. Cockatiels are enough larger that it's a different matter.


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## Kujen (Jun 9, 2007)

I discontinued the medicine as the ER vet told me. I think I will discontinue the metoclopramide now as well, as he has not vomited since that one morning. Maybe, hopefully, it was just a one time thing with him eating so much that it got a little impacted or something? 

His poop is looking pretty normal again. I don’t see undigested seeds. The only odd thing right now is his wings are trembling, like he is scared. He is not fluffed up. He is eating and drinking normally. He comes to me for millet spray. He is still not singing, but he does do the little chirrup contact calls, especially when I leave the room.

I think it will do him some good not to be handled for a while. I will keep an eye on him and make another avian vet visit if needed, maybe even a checkup (I really wish I could weigh him myself). I will ask the vet if it’s possible that I could bring in some droppings for testing without having to subject Buddy to another long car ride and vet visit.

Also, just a tip for the folks on this forum. The vet was amazing at catching him. He kept a computer monitor on in the room so he could see, and then switched the room lights off. He was able to grab him quickly and without any flight because he said it takes longer for a bird’s eyes to adjust. I have not been able to replicate this myself as I don’t think I got the room dark enough, but maybe someone will find this useful.


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