# Mom is weak… start hand feeding?



## Paracutie

Hi, my breeding parents (first clutch) had 6 eggs, 4 hatched, 1 died after 2 days (very small compared to the oldest one) and the one more died after a week or so. 2 remaining look ok but since this morning mom seems very weak and can’t fly properly in the cage (she climbed the wall to reach the nest). It seems she is not able to feed the babies as they keep screening more often than last days. 

Shall I start hand feeding the babies?

If so, should I separate them fully or once I feed should I put them back to the nest?

Babies also seem to have weak feet and can’t stand properly. One is a bit older than 3 weeks and the one 2 weeks and half. I give normal mixed parakeet food and also spray millet. I started giving cuttlebone from few days ago but they didn’t have it from the beginning.

thanks for your advice


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## FaeryBee

*If you start hand feeding the babies then put them back in the nest box after they are fed.*

*Planned Co-Parenting in Raising Tame Chicks*

*Hand Feeding and Weaning Guide

Your adult female needs calcium supplements in addition to the cuttlebone. That means something like Calci-Boost or Calci-Vet.
Remove her from the cage and put her in a cage of her own. She needs to rest and recuperate.
If she seems weak and ill on Monday then you need to get her to an Avian Veterinarian right away.
Avian Vets have special training to determine the cause of symptoms resulting from illness or trauma.
This is important as "regular" vets will often overlook symptoms that are quickly obvious to an Avian Vet.
When you rely on anyone who has not had training in Avian diagnosis and care, you may be delaying effective treatment.
This can prolong suffering that may be avoidable.
The bird will often require a more intense, prolonged treatment with a poorer chance of full recovery than it would have if you seek prompt professional diagnosis and treatment at the first sign of illness.
If there are no Avian Vets near you, please find an Exotic Pet Veterinarian with experience in dealing with small birds.
Locating an Avian Veterinarian


Is the Father in the cage?
Has he been helping with the feeding?
What diet are the adult birds eating? They should be getting fresh vegetables and pellets as well as a high quality seed mix.
Have these babies started eating on their own at all yet?
Had you been offering food right outside the nest box as well as water for the female?
How old is the adult female?
How old is the adult male?
Does the nest box have a concave bottom?
Do the chicks have splayed legs?


PLEASE do not allow your male and female to have another clutch.
You need to do everything necessary to prevent any breeding in the future.*

*A heartfelt plea to forum members new and old*
*Tips For Discouraging Breeding*
*Before You Ever Consider Breeding Your Budgies*
*Guidance for Breeding Advice Threads*


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## Paracutie

Thanks for your advice. 
I started hand-feeding and put the babies back to the nest. Also removed the mom to a separate cage. She was in the nest but didn’t seem to come out as before to get food for babies. I’m not sure if the father is feeding them… he is in the cage and sometimes go to the nest. maybe I have to put a camera inside the nest to check but so far babies are eating formula by spoon. I’m feeding every 4 hours.
Parents are eating “daily blend” mixed seed and spray millet. Tried to give some fruits in the past but they didn’t try.
I put key-kob material in the nest box but yes unfortunately both chicks have splayed legs… 
It might be due to nutrition.. not sure with hand feeding formula there is a chance that it will be improved?!
Chicks are not eating on their own yet. I think I still need to hand feed them for a while. 
I bought the pair together with eggs from a breeder, not sure about the age of male and female but sounded like it’s their first clutch.

So when should I put the female back to the family cage? Or did you mean this pair should be separated and not breeding any more?
I attached a picture of the older chick. He/she cannot stand…


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## FaeryBee

*You should definitely not allow the pair to breed again.  

The nest box did not have a concave bottom did it?
You need to switch it out for a proper nest box with a concave bottom and use either aspen shavings or pine shavings in it.
The babies need to be treated for the splayed legs starting immediately.*

*Splayed Legs in Budgie Chicks*

*How old are the chicks now?
How old is the adult female?
How old is the adult male?* 

*How is the female doing today? Is she eating, drinking and pooping normally?*


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## Paracutie

I really appreciate your input. It helps a lot. No, the neat box is not concave but I put kaytee kaykob material to make it rough. I have pine shaving but should I change the bottom to concave shale then put pine shaving on it?

Mom is doing good, eating, drinking, pooping by still not using her wings to fly (prefersusing beak and foot to move around).

I started hand feeding but seems the father is also feeding as some time carp is already full and they don’t take food (and of course I don’t force them).

One chick is 23 days old (hatched 9/3) and the other one is 19 days old (hatched 9/7).

I don’t know the age of parents, I bought them together one month ago and they already had the eggs.

My current priority to help the chicks to grow (and hopefully correct the splayed legs), but I’m concerned why the parents cannot be together anymore… Won’t it be ok if I give them the right nutritions for next time, or this is something more fundamnetal that they should be breeding anymore? I don’t really have an intention to breed but I want to put them together once the mom is recovered.

I will try adhesive tape method for chicks. I tried combjnation of rubber band and tape in between but it was removed when the chick was moving around.

sorry, I’m quite new in this world so appreciate your advice.

thanks


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## FaeryBee

*May I ask why you bought a pair of budgies that already had eggs?
Did you get them from a breeder?
Can you contact that individual to find out the age of the parents and whether or not they are related?
I'm assuming the nest box that you used came with the two budgies and eggs which tells me the person who had the birds did not know what they were doing.


Change the nest box out to one with a concave bottom and use pine shavings.

Have you had any luck getting the adhesive tape to work on the chicks legs?

If not, I'd try the sponge method.
Sponge method for Splayed Legs

Do you have a good Avian Veterinarian nearby that can help you with this treatment?
I so wish you'd indicated sooner there was a problem with the babies legs. 
As the chicks are older, it is going to take longer to correct the problem and it needs to be addressed sooner rather than later.

You do not know anything about either the age, health or temperament of the parents.
Those two budgies should NOT be bred again in the future. This is very important for the female's health and well-being.
If you allow her to have another clutch in the future the risks to her survival are very high.

Additionally, you don't have the knowledge and experience necessary to be considering breeding.
Before breeding any species, it is important to learn as much about the animals, their personalities, and the best practices to follow for responsible and ethical breeding prior to making the commitment to take on the responsibility. This requires extensive research and an openness to continual learning.

Let's work on getting your chicks healthy before we delve into the best way for you to set up cages for the health and well-being of your birds.
Are you planning to keep these two chicks?


*


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## Paracutie

Thanks again for your feedback and advice.

We wanted to have a pair, and the person I bought them (not a breeder) said they already have eggs. I bought them together with their nest box as we didn’t want to move the eggs.

I confirmed with her that she got the pair from a breeder this summer as 2 years birds and also the breeder told her that birds were not related and were chosen from different cages.

I made a tentative hand-made concave bottom for the nest with pine shavings till I get the nest box with concave bottom.

Chicks now have adhesive tape between legs, the bigger one seems to struggle more due to weight, but the smaller one tries to stand on her feet somehow. I attached a picture of the smaller chick with the tape.

The mom is still in a separate cage, eating, drinking and moving around but not super active. Her cage is in the same room and she reacts to the father, it seems she wants to go back together. Should I keep her separate, or can I put her in the family cage and continue co-parenting?

Co-parenting goes relatively ok. I set to feed them every 4 hours but since the father also feeds in between, sometimes they are half-full and eat just a little bit. I check the carp.

Pictures are green mom, blue dad and the smaller chick with adhesive tape.

thanks again for helping


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## Paracutie

Also your last question, yes if I can treat the chicks, I would like to keep them…


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## srirachaseahawk

The wee ones are very cute


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## FaeryBee

*Do you have a good Avian Veterinarian nearby that can help you with this treatment?* 
*Locating an Avian Veterinarian*

*Move the mother's cage into a different room away from the father for now.
I know you want them back together but now is not the time. 
You need to give them a few weeks apart to ensure that they do not try to mate immediately again upon getting back together.

The tape on the older chick's legs doesn't look as if it is pulling the legs close enough together. 
The left leg still looks as though it is splayed too far out.
Keep in mind that treating the older chick is going to be the most difficult because its bones have already set more.
This is why it would be good if you can find an Avian Vet to help you get the splayed legs under control.

I'm glad to hear the father is feeding the chicks well at this point and that the co-parenting is working so far.

Let's make sure we get these two babies healthy and happy!*


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