Talk Budgies Next Top Model - Feedback Thread

[Pippin's mom]

Hi Everyone!:)

As this season of Talk Budgies Next Top Model is nearing it's climax I thought it would be nice to get some feedback regarding the competition.:)

Phillip and I have already discussed the length of the competition a little, not in depth as of yet. Our feeling is that it is too long at present and it might be better if we we selected less contestants and made the competition shorter, but hold the competition more often. This would also give more members a chance to participate in the competition.:)

We would also like to know your honest thoughts about allowing Talk Budgies staff to participate in future competitions as contestants.

We would appreciate hearing your comments on these topics and anything else you feel might improve the competition. We are also open to new challenge ideas so feel free to make your suggestions for consideration.:)

Please keep this a positive thread..if there are criticisms please make them constructive offering solutions and suggestions not complaints.:)

Thank you very much! We value your input.:)

[gpgilbert]

As a contestant, I really enjoyed the competition in the beginning. However, as each challenge seemed to draw out, I felt that the contest lost both momentum and the interest of the general membership.

Judging time should be kept to a strict deadline and eliminations posted on schedule. There should be a process established before the competition begins to make sure that a timely decision can be made (concensus, majority rule, flip of a coin). Also, changing judges or adding guest judges during the competition affects the consistency of the decisions. Contestants change their approach to follow the recommendations of the particular judges, but new judges may have different opinions. The same judges should be used throughout the contest and use the stated criteria set at the beginning to judge each challenge. The criteria should not be changed during the contest.

I also think that ex parte communication between the contestants and judges should be prohibited. The judges should communicate their critiques in the judges' thread and not make any other comments, suggestions, or explanations in the general discussion threads. This will help maintain the integrity of the judging process and eliminate any appearance of favoritism. The judges shouldn't have to defend their decisions and keep trying to explain why they made them. The one post in the critiques should be enough.

The Member of the Public portion added interest, but selecting two members contributed to the loss of momentum. Perhaps next time, only one MOTP should be selected. Also, when a contestant drops out or misses the deadline, they should be automatically eliminated and NOT replaced. The judges should still eliminate another contestant that week based on the entries. That will keep the contest on schedule rather than dragging it out an additional week.

All that said, I think the TBNTM contest is a lot of fun and a great opportunity for budgie guardians to bond with their birds and create some very unique and beautiful photos. It is also a chance for members to interact and get to know each other better. I would be happy to help in any way I can in future competitions. I think it will just continue to get better and better as the producers learn from previous years and refine the process.

[helloyo53]

Are non participating members allowed to comment?

[stacey101]

i love it , at times a bit longish , i found myself as a contestant to loose motive after week 5 which then i would have an awsome picture sometimes and the other time a half decent ( ie last week ). Overal BRAVO i love tbntm

[Pippin's mom]

Are non participating members allowed to comment?

Yes Brandon, everyone is welcome to comment unless of course they know nothing about the competition.:)

Peter~ You made many great suggestions and observations.:) I completely agree that the judges should keep their comments to the judges critique and not comment or explain the reasons for their decisions in the public thread. In fact I just brought this point up to Phillip this morning.

It was my poor decision to bring in another contestant after Merit withdrew...unfortunately, I realized this when it was too late. Like you said we learn a bit more with each competition.:)

Normally guest judges are not brought in at all..in fact this was a first and producers are not supposed to judge unless the judges really need some help, but that is rare. However, this time we had a judge who could no longer keep the commitment due to real life and we had several other behind the scene problems. We really didn't have a choice. The guest judges only helped out twice during the competition and I can assure you that the guest judges judged on the merits of the photos alone. They went by the same criteria as the regular judges.

I couldn't agree with you more about sticking to a strict schedule so the competition doesn't drag on as I feel it has done this season. I really do like to keep to the schedule...makes everything run a lot smoother.:) Actually, we already do have a process established for the judges..it is majority rules..if two out of three judges agree that's the final decision. If none of the judges agree that is usually when a producer will step in to help with the decision, but as I said in past competitions this has been rare.

Thank you to everyone who has commented so far. I'm not seeing anyone address the question about allowing staff to participate in future competitions. We do have some concerns about this and would really like to hear your thoughts.:)

[Pippin's mom]

i love it , at times a bit longish , i found myself as a contestant to loose motive after week 5 which then i would have an awsome picture sometimes and the other time a half decent ( ie last week ). Overal BRAVO i love tbntm

This is helpful Stacey.:) I have noticed a pattern..the competition always begins with great excitement and anticipation then seems to begin to fizzle a bit after the first few weeks..then begins to pick up again for the finale. This is why we are thinking of shortening the competitions, but having them more often instead of one LOOOOG one once or twice a year. I think four months is awfully long and waring on people and their birds.

[helloyo53]

The only concern I have been having, and a few people have probably heard this before, is the judging because of the quality of the photo. Some people don't have amazingly awesome cameras where you can control everything about the picture, so it could be hard to get a good quality photo that is clear. I've found some weeks in this contest that some members, who have a great photo with good interaction and stuff have been eliminated because of the quality. Now, I could understand that if the photo's quality was so bad that you couldn't tell what was happening. But if the budgie is doing what they are supposed to be doing with great interaction, I don't think the photo quality should matter.

I know this may sound biased, but I personally don't see a problem with staff participating. And I'm not saying that just because I am staff. I just think that anyone should be able to participate, staff or non staff. It really shouldn't matter.

And it was a little long too, but that's already been mentioned.

Other than that, the competition went great. I think is was very successful this year, and everyone did a great job! Thanks for the entertainment for the viewers of this season, and I am looking forward to next season! :D

[aka.pody]

I think anyone should be able to participate. Staff, new members, anyone. The more the merrier. :D

I just think that deadlines need to be adhered to. That includes contestants as well as judges.

I think it's been a great contest so far. It was great fun while Rosie was in it and it's still great fun seeing what everyone does for their challenge. Everybody puts their all into it.

It's all about our beautiful budgies and who will be Talk Budgies Next Top Model. I'm not losing sight of that and I hope no one else does. :)
And I do hope it continues next season. And maybe even a different type of contest. There's bound to be new members and old that are always eager to show off their little darlins'.

Thanks Julea for letting us have this opportunity to give a little feedback. The contest is a big hit. I can't wait to find out who will be Talk Budgies Next Top Model. http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm465/akapody/hyper.gif

[stacey101]

I think if in the end if we have shorter tbntm maybe have a finally each year where all the winners would compeat against each other for the top spot

[AngelWings]

I think if in the end if we have shorter tbntm maybe have a finally each year where all the winners would compeat against each other for the top spot

That's a great idea! :) I love it.

[Pippin's mom]

Brandon~ I absolutely agree with you on photo quality. Believe me I know that not everyone is the greatest photographer (myself included) and that not everyone has the same quality camera. When I was a judge and even this time when I have had to help judge it has never been about photo quality for me ..I have always judged on interaction and how well the contestant met the challenge over photo quality because this isn't a photography competition. Like you said unless a photo is so terrible you can't hardly see the subject it doesn't matter.

Stacey~ I LOVE your idea of having contestants who have won go up against each other! FUN!:)

[atomshell]

Now I'm REALLY confused. :S

I thought it was a photo contest. I mean photo quality was mentioned a lot in the critiques. Out of focus, too much sun, not enough sun, be careful of the flash, overexposed, underexposed, zoom in, etc... Those are all "quality of photo" terms.
I agree that not everyone can afford a nice camera but maybe the judges could agree how much this counts before the judging begins and be consistent about if it matters or not.

Also the line of interaction seemed a little fuzzy to me. Maybe you could come up with an easy to follow checklist that everyone could follow. I am new (and not trying to be rude I promise) but I got confused about what was considered interaction and what was not a few times.

It was a lot of fun and everyone was so supportive and nice. It was a great way for me to bond with Loki. I hope you continue to have the contest because it has been a lot of fun to participate in and to follow.

It did seem drawn out at times - especially to people like me for whom patience is a constant battle. But all of you are volunteers and doing it on your own (family, work, fid) time. That would be cool like Stacey said to have lots of little ones and then a grand finale.

[Bethany]

I agree, its a little too long :) I've lost intrest :o I barely check the thread anymore, only who got voted out & what the next challange is.. then I comment once & I'm er... gone :o

I'd like it if more people got the chance to enter.. and if there were deadlines for the judges to have their comments in :)

& I also agree that it should have little to do with picture quality.. more of the actual picutre/interaction :)

[AngelWings]

Blurry pictures, we know that not everyone can have a certain type of camera and we don't take off points for it being blurry.

We mentioned the zoom because we like to see the model's face once in a while. Full body shots are nice, but we like to see the model's face sometimes (depending on challenge). Also no back shots where we can't see the face, those are a big no no :p

The flash i don't have a problem with unless it starts to wash out the colour of the budgie or if the flash reflects off the props and causes a big distraction. Like you see this amazing entry then in the background you see a bunch of little flashes reflecting off almost all of the props, not very nice to look at :p

Interaction - A budgie standing on a prop = not interaction. A budgie biting or doing something with the prop - interacting. All the photos you sent in had amazing interaction, Loki captured it perfectly. Photos that aren't interacting is when the budgie just stands on a prop or beside a prop and not really doing anything. Like if the budgie is standing beside an instrument = not interaction. If the budgie is touching the instrument with the beak 'playing' it = interaction. Sorry my examples aren't very clear, i don't know how to explain it anymore :o

[louara]

First off I just want to say that Gracie-Mae and I had a lot of fun with this contest and still enjoy following it:)
Having members of the staff participate is ok with me.:)

Each challenge should be 7 days, start to finish.
I think that having 10 challenges and 15 (13 + 2 MOTP) competitors are fine, but as previously mentioned there were too many delays this season. The first challenge was due on Sept.12th. Factor in the 4 double eliminations and allowing two weeks for the final, and even allowing an extra MOTP entry and the final would have been announced on Nov.3rd
The problem is that the deadlines were not adhered to. The contestants are given 5 days to submit the entry. They should not have to wait another 4-5 days for a decision to be posted. The judges have a 48 hr.deadline and must stick to it. I already commented on the Judges Critique thread earlier in the contest so I won't repeat it here.
The "Save the Contestant" feature is good and fun but it also caused delays so maybe it could be reworked.
The videos that announce the next challenge were an exciting, unique feature. But unfortunately they stopped and I found this disappointing. When they were finally put up, there are mistakes in them. Wrong pictures with the wrong weeks, and some photos are missing. This made me feel that no one was interested in doing this feature. I think if the videos cannot be done every week and done right, don't do them.
The cast this season is amazing. Everyone has stuck to the rules and has been more than patient with the numerous delays.
You may need to think about adding more crew members in order to avoid these problems in the future. Have someone just to help out in the MOTP thread as there are more questions posted there than on the competitors thread. Have backup judges that are following the contest and will be able to step in if need be and stick to the schedule as much as possible.
Post the challenge on a Tuesday; entries are due by Sunday; (as a former contestant I liked it when I had a weekend day to take the photo) decision made on Tuesday, post the next challenge etc.

I know that you, Julea, have been working very diligently since the start of this contest but frankly and honestly I feel that your partner has not.
I’m sure there are good reasons for it that is none of my business, but you should not commit to something of this nature if you cannot complete the process.

Thanks for letting me have my say.

Stacey, I love love love your idea of an All-Star Top Model Contest, I hope it happens!:D

[stacey101]

glad you three like the idea :D

[helenvee]

I have really enjoyed the tbntm quite a bit! I do have a few comments though...
The length (like everybody else) was too long, most people seemed to loose interest. It would have been shorter if people didn't keep getting added to the competition, don't get me wrong, all the motp entries have been great but when there has been a double elimination week and then two motp entries had been added... that part got boring because it was taking ages to get to the finish.
Also the MOTP thread got waay too cluttered with posts on photos and it was hard to find the pictures that people had added. If it was like the proper tbntm photo thread that would be great and have people comment in another thread so it wasn't so cluttered... if you get what I mean? lol

I think there should be more choice on the challenges as well. Like some weeks have the choice of two themes.. Or even assigning a different challenge for each contestant and the viewers would have to wait and see what assignment they have been given.. That would interest viewers a bit more as there would be more difference as to what to expect.

Just one more comment! I think there should be a 'Simon Cowell' judge in the mix :P..... Just a suggestion lol

[riotfox]

tbntm has been so much fun! i think yes it is too long to wait sometimes for stuff to actually happen. i reckon like in the actual tv show, we should have some small challenge as well as the main photo, but maybe the mini challenge should have a two or three day deadline. that way you could have something going on almost all the time. i guess that might be hard if you were pressed for time, but like just really simple things like a preening photo or a close up shot or maybe even a short video of them singing. nothing that would require a lot of planning.

[birdiebuddie]

I ditto on Louara's post 1000%. I week i got eliminated, i was tired of the contest, camera was on the fritz and Mojito was not feeling the theme, so i was totally over it, the time between challenges ending and the results being posted was wayyy too long, at the beginning i was itching for them to start on time, then i knew they wouldnt and totally gave up, the organization was bad, there needs to be a 100% planned schedule. The replacing of contestants was a bad choice to make.

[riotfox]

ooh ooh i have another idea! i think the judges should have one day to pick a bottom three, then the public should make the final decision for one day in a poll.

and also about the photo quality issue, if the judges are having a hard time deciding based on the other factors, i personally have no problem with photo quality coming into the decision. i mean after all it is all about the photos.

[louara]

and also about the photo quality issue, if the judges are having a hard time deciding based on the other factors, i personally have no problem with photo quality coming into the decision. i mean after all it is all about the photos.

I agree with Fox. Right from the outset I knew my time would be limited because my camera could just not compete with some of the other contestants. I made the choice to compete anyway and it made me have to think of creative shots in order to stay in. I was surprised that we made it as far as we did.
After all ,it is a photo contest and the quality of the photos should be considered.

[Corina]

I agree 100% with Peter, Louara and Riotfox.

Here are my views:

- I didn't mind at all that a member of the staff participated.
- It was way too long as stated already.
- It was fun at the beginning. I started getting tired of it after week 4
- It was very inconsistent
- Way too many changes and delays
- The judges should stick to the rules and same criteria throughout the whole competition.
- If it is stated in the challenge thread that past entries won't be considered for future voting then stick to it or don't post it at all.


I'll be completely honest here. I entered the contest because it seemed fun and nothing else. I liked the challenges even though they required too much time and planning. I thought it was a little unfair for some people since we don't all have the same resources, of course a set up with amazing props and printed background is going to look better than a hand drawn one, and a photo taken with a DSLR is going to be 1000 times more appealing than one taken with a 5 megapixel camera especially with a moving target.

Also, I know this contest is based on the TV show so it must have judges but I would have liked it better if it was the public who chose the winners or maybe have both public and judge votes. I got tired of having to please the judges and plan my set up around their opinions and suggestions.

And lastly: I didn't like the DIVA card idea at all. Well at first it seemed useful but using it shouldn't mean elimination. It was stated that it could be used on all challenges except the final. If using it far in the competition means sure elimination then don't say that it can be used on all challenges. You should have said that it was only safe to use it in the beginning.

Well those are my views and opinions. I know you will find a way to make this competition fun and fair in the future. It's already popular all it needs is some consistency :)


I liked Riotfox's idea of the mini challenges and simple challenges :P

[FudgieTheBudgie]

I agree with Corina 100% !! Also if you ever need any future judges i would LOVE to help!

[riotfox]

glad you liked the idea corina. sorry if you guys are getting a bit tired of my comments, but i keep thinking of new stuff to say.

this probably is not really avoidable but i thought some of the challenges were a bit too hard. i liked the ones that were fairly simple like the sleeping and the best friend one, and th ones that were pretty open to interpretation like the talent show and to an extent the extreme sports. the ones i didnt like were the ones that absolutely required a lot of props and/or sets such as the travelling to a country one amd the occupation one because like corina said we dont all have the same resources, and also it is hard if your budgie isnt particularly adventurous (not everyone is as cooperative as chibi chibi :p lol)

[helloyo53]

(not everyone is as cooperative as chibi chibi :p lol)
:laughing:


After reading some of the comments on here, I would like to add a few more things if I might.

I agree with maybe having the public voting for the entries. This would be great for the judges because they won't have to argue all the time (;)), and we will know exactly when the results will be. It would be kind of like an American Idol thing: the judges say what they think, the public (voters) take that into consideration, and they vote based on the judges comments, and what they really like. I think that could actually speed the competition up.

Having the public vote could also eliminate some bias in the decisions. Having only three people possibly liking the same bird, well, you will know which bird will be staying in the competition until the end right? However, if you had the public vote, that's way more than three people making the decision, and the people of Talk Budgies probably like different birds, so having the public make the decisions instead of the judges, this will definitely eliminate a lot of bias.

I also agree with Corina about the DIVA card. Now, I know she was voted out because she used a DIVA card late in the competition and the judges felt that she probably shouldn't have used it, we understand that. But the thing is, I agree with what she said. If using it late in the competition means sure elimination, you should maybe state that.

And just thinking about it now, maybe stating that would be a bad idea, because people would want to use it on the first week rather than keeping it and being tempted to use it late in the contest, but then re-thinking that because they will be afraid of getting out.

Here's my suggestions on the DIVA card:

Treat any DIVA card photo like the other photos. So in this case, Corina's should have been treated like the other photos. I was so surprised that Kenji got out. It was great, GREAT, interaction, and it fit the DIVA card challenge perfectly. And had you been looking at quality of photo, well, I think it speaks for itself.


OR


Just don't use it at all. If the judges, like they did they week, see using the DIVA card late in the competition as being "weak", then maybe you shouldn't have the DIVA card at all.


Just food for thought, and I'm sorry if I sounded a wee bit rude in here.

[atomshell]

These are some great ideas! I particularly like the bit about the public vote. That would have to take some pressure off the judges and at the same time keep the public interested in what's going on. What makes Idol and SYTYCD and those type shows so popular is that the public gets to have a voice. Are they always right? Who knows but it seems more consistent and unbiased. One of the things that I think made it so hard for me personally to choose a favorite at times is that some entry's props would seem technologically advanced and others obviously homemade. Who is to say which is cuter or better? I think that is a matter of personal preference that no guidelines in the world could help. That's where I think the public vote should weigh in.

Which leads me to my major criticism - the "wait." It seemed super unfair that the contestants were held to a deadline and that the judges could post their decisions at leisure. Or so it seemed if you were biting your fingernails waiting for a decision. Thank goodness I only had to do that a few times. I told Peter that if I were to having to wait around like that week after week for FOUR months like him I would never enter again because while it's great fun, it's also time consuming.

I'm just not sure I agree on the thing about photo quality though. For me it kind of goes along with the whole "do you mind if staff participates" question. When Kim would turn in one amazing quality photo after another I would email Peter and say "Did you see how crisp and beautiful her picture quality is?" And we would agree that it was crazy beautiful and then both try harder to beat her. But we did it out of admiration and friendly competition. We never disliked her for it or wished her out of the competition. It just made me try harder to do better. So should staff get to participate? Sure! As long as they aren't treated differently.

I took one entry on my phone camera, one on a camera that got dropped in the river this summer, and then a couple on my brother's camera. I think my photo quality was inconsistent and it frustrated me that I couldn't get a super clear shot. But I still think the aesthetically pleasing aspect should be considered too. It should definitely come into play if say two contestants are tied on creativity and interaction. If one is sharp and clear and another is really blurry the better quality should win and nothing from the past should be considered. But of course if Kim were to win competition after competition then.... she should be made to use a disposable point and shoot or be forced to work with one hand behind her back or something. JK Kim! :D

We did the same thing over Chibi Chibi. We would say "She can get that bird to do anything!!!!" in amazement. :bowrofl: Loki is not super tame and I could NEVER get her to do that stuff, so it makes sense that Chibi Chibi has made it this far. And Firecracker had been so consistent and on target the whole competition. I can imagine the judging would be really difficult. That's why it seems there needs to be like a checklist or something on criteria that will help the judges remain consistent week after week and then let the public take over. Did that rambling make ANY sense?? haha

I also agree with Brandon about Corina and Kenji. My Kenji-Crush aside, I was shocked that she was voted out of the competition for all the reasons he stated above. It seemed to go against what the contestants had been told the whole time. I did not mean to hurt feelings or seem rude about it though - just frustrated about inconsistencies. Firecracker, Chibi Chibi and Phoenix are all so beautiful and photogenic and I wish you all the best. I can't wait to see your entries!!

[louara]

These are great ideas and opinions. I too was very surprised to see Kenji leave the competition. Having non-participating members of the forum vote is a great idea and I think will peak the interest of members not participating.
However, it is not something that should be implemented if it causes more delays.
On TV shows like Idol and DWTS, the judges give their score immediately after seeing the contestant. Then the public has 24 hrs to vote. This would mean for TBNTM that the judges 48 hr time limit will be cut to 24 hr and then open a poll for 24 hrs. It would work if everyone involved agrees to meet their deadline. The judges score could count for 70% of the mark and the public poll could count for 30% or whatever percentage the producers deemed as fair.
This would also elimate the need for the "Save the Contestant" feature.

[stacey101]

(not everyone is as cooperative as chibi chibi :p lol)

LOL , heheh
If you want i'll post a thread on how to get your budgie to lay on his back

We did the same thing over Chibi Chibi. We would say "She can get that bird to do anything!!!!" in amazement.
thanks , i guess i'll have to make this video wicked :rolleyes: so much pressure

[helloyo53]

LOL , heheh
If you want i'll post a thread on how to get your budgie to lay on his back

I'd like to see a thread on how you get your bugdies so tame! :p

[stacey101]

I'd like to see a thread on how you get your bugdies so tame! :p

haha , okay im on it.... after my movie is over :p

[riotfox]

yeah that would be great actually stacey lol

[Masae]

I skimmed through this thread and I agree with most of the critique made toward the competition, such as issues about the length, sticking to deadlines, dwindling interest, etc. There is one thing that caught my eye, though, that I really do not agree with at all: Allowing the public to vote on the pictures.

While it’s an interesting thought and a good concept to go by, allowing the public to vote on a picture without a need of an explanation leaves the door wide open to constant biased votes. A lot of people (I’m not saying everyone) will begin to play favorites through the competition, and it will most likely end up with the same contestants getting all the votes, over and over and over.

Some, who don’t fully understand what and how to judge, will no doubt end up voting for the “prettiest” picture without considering props, interaction, photo quality, etc.

Even if the voting is used for a “second opinion” of sorts for the official judges, it has enormous potential to spark drama and irritation on both ends. If the judges decide to go against the poll, the public might become upset with the misconception that they have the final say. Eventually the judges might feel obligated to keep the public happy, and simply go with the poll just to keep peace.

Granted that it might work out, what I’ve mentioned is a very real possibility of what could happen. In my honest opinion, three unbiased judges who know what to look for, and PERHAPS a producer to keep them in line, is all that’s needed to make a decision. Anything more would be fluff, and unnecessary potential confusion.

[gpgilbert]

I think the greatest value of having the "public" vote is that it will keep the general membership interested in the competition. It seemed very obvious to me that fewer and fewer "non-participants" were posting and commenting as the competition wore on. I personally don't think it's a problem for people to vote for the "prettiest picture." Once voting is turned over to the public, no one else has any control over the outcome. If the judges made their comments as the photos were posted and the poll were opened as soon as the last judges comments were posted, then the membership could consider the judges comments along with their own preference. If they happen to vote for the same contestant "over and over and over" then that contestant obvious has the most appeal.

I think it all depends on the focus of the contest. If it is meant to have limited appeal to a few participants, then continue "as is." However, if we would like to generate more interest and greater participation, then I think allowing everyone to have a voice will help.

Allowing the general membership to vote will eliminate the "closed loop" feeling of the contest. There can't be any question of partiality or favoritism if every member has the opportunity to vote. Whether "staff members" or "members of the public" are the contestants, all will have the same public scrutiny and the voice of TalkBugies will be heard by all.

[AngelWings]

I agree with Masae in terms off public voting. I know many people would just vote for their favourites, not in terms of 'the best picture' but also in "I love this budgie and i want him to win" or "This is my good friend's budgie so i'll keep voting for him to win"

What i was thinking, what if there were a poll with the bottom 3 chosen by the judges (every challenge) and the public would get to pick which of those three to eliminate?

Also in previous competitions i know there weren't critiques every week. I know when i was a contestant in the all bird competition, many weeks we wouldn't have the judges' comments. What if next seasons there would be sort of a "guideline" with pictures demonstrating it? Sort of like "Good interaction" with a picture of a budgie doing a challenge with good interaction below it and beside it "bad interaction" with a picture of a bird just standing beside a prop? and basically have this for the major things such as interaction, lighting, angle, etc..? What do you guys think?

I agree this competition did run a bit too long but there was a bumpy road this time. Many contestants didn't pull through such as they quit or they didn't turn in a photo or were eliminated. I think next time before entering a contest, you should be sure that you can devote your time to it and not quit half way through as it can delay the process for the competition.

Also with Member of the Public entries, How about there is a little competition with the member of the public every week & the winner of that gets to enter the competition for the finals with the regular contestants?

There could be someone organizing that and since it is a member of the public, the public could vote on that one? but the favouritism might also intervene.. but since it's a member of the public then i think the public should choose who they think best represents them to enter the official competition?

Just letting you guys know, we did have exactly two days to send in our decisions but with the fact that we all live in different timezones it did complicate matters. Sometimes we decided earlier but we waited until 2 days had past to post up the threads.

. The judges shouldn't have to defend their decisions and keep trying to explain why they made them.

I agree with this but however, since everyone is getting so worked up, i feel like i have a reason to explain my decision. I've explained it before but people are still getting worked up over it so i will explain it again. I'd really hate it if people hated me over this :o

I did not vote Corina out because she used the Diva card. I did however have a bottom 3 and had to pick one out of those three. They all were good entries but i could only mention 2 names and not 3 so i looked back all the entries and saw who out of the three i thought was the strongest contestant so i'd have a bottom 2 instead. The other judges and producers said their own bottom two then we saw who had the most votes and that's how it was decided. :)

[gpgilbert]

Having the judges pick the bottom "three" or whatever number and allow the public to eliminate one would be a good idea, but it might add time to the competition. If a large segment of the membership voted, I think it would over ride favoritism and it wouldn't really matter why they picked a particular budgie if they all liked it. I think a top model should be the most popular.

[gpgilbert]

P.S. Sue, I don't think anyone hates you or any of the judges for your decisions. You have all done the very best you could....and it has often been hard. By agreeing to be a judge, you put yourself in the uncomfortable decision of eliminating contestants. It's hard, and it's not fun, but I think you all have done a very good job, and you shouldn't have to defend your decisions.

[aka.pody]

P.S. Sue, I don't think anyone hates you or any of the judges for your decisions. You have all done the very best you could....and it has often been hard. By agreeing to be a judge, you put yourself in the uncomfortable decision of eliminating contestants. It's hard, and it's not fun, but I think you all have done a very good job, and you shouldn't have to defend your decisions.

I agree 100%. It's okay to feel bad about eliminating contestants. That's what makes you a good person. And judges don't need to explain their decision.
It's a fun competition but everybody can't win.
Here Sue, have a candy cane. http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm465/akapody/Christmas/candycane2.gif

[HAWK1506]

i havent paid much attention to recent model contests but i think....... you ready for this?...... double model pictures

instead of just having one model and trying to get to the top why not have a pair try out for the top?

i would like to see some creative photos of 2 budgies instead of one

[AngelWings]

Having the judges pick the bottom "three" or whatever number and allow the public to eliminate one would be a good idea, but it might add time to the competition. If a large segment of the membership voted, I think it would over ride favoritism and it wouldn't really matter why they picked a particular budgie if they all liked it. I think a top model should be the most popular.

The case with this is what if the popular model isn't as talented as a non popular one? Last TBNTM winner wasn't the most popular contestant. The most popular was Mouse he sure was talented but i'm sure most of us were cheering just 'cause he happened to be the cutest thing alive :XD: Tango ended up winning but if i'm sure if it were up to the public they'd all be like "Mouse!!!!"... I'd be there killing myself as the top 3 happened to be my favourite budgies here on TB :XD:

P.S. Sue, I don't think anyone hates you or any of the judges for your decisions. You have all done the very best you could....and it has often been hard. By agreeing to be a judge, you put yourself in the uncomfortable decision of eliminating contestants. It's hard, and it's not fun, but I think you all have done a very good job, and you shouldn't have to defend your decisions.

Aww thanks :)
I just always have to explain myself.. I know how easy people could misunderstand and hate me for a small decision i made :o

I agree 100%. It's okay to feel bad about eliminating contestants. That's what makes you a good person. And judges don't need to explain their decision.
It's a fun competition but everybody can't win.
Here Sue, have a candy cane. http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm465/akapody/Christmas/candycane2.gif

Aww thanks Arlene :)
*hugs*
i havent paid much attention to recent model contests but i think....... you ready for this?...... double model pictures

instead of just having one model and trying to get to the top why not have a pair try out for the top?

i would like to see some creative photos of 2 budgies instead of one

I'm not sure i get this :o
Like having a Talkbudgies next top "models"?
Creative photos of two budgies? I don't get it :XD: Could you explain it further? i'm really slow today sorry :o

[birdiebuddie]

Like pairs of budgies competing against other pairs.

I dont like this idea just because some people only have one budgie, lots of us only have one.

Plus it would be harder to judge if say one of the budgies was spot on and another wasn't.

And we were allowed to have "extras" in our photos...its just harder to get two models focusing.

[AngelWings]

Like pairs of budgies competing against other pairs.

I dont like this idea just because some people only have one budgie, lots of us only have one.

Plus it would be harder to judge if say one of the budgies was spot on and another wasn't.

Oh i see, i thought they meant like "have two winners instead of one" :XD:
Yes i agree, it'd be harder to judge if one budgie did good while the other one didn't. Plus it'd take longer as well and like you mentioned, not everyone has more than one budgie. If they do have more than one budgie, they may have one tame and several wild ones that may not cooperate as well.

[stacey101]

Oh i see, i thought they meant like "have two winners instead of one" :XD:
Yes i agree, it'd be harder to judge if one budgie did good while the other one didn't. Plus it'd take longer as well and like you mentioned, not everyone has more than one budgie. If they do have more than one budgie, they may have one tame and several wild ones that may not cooperate as well.

i agree with you , i dont really like the idea of pairs competing too :o

[Budgietom]

Hi Everyone! :)

Sorry I haven't posted on this thread yet :o I just got back from my stupid 3 day camp. Let me tell you, it was TORTURE! :eek: :rolleyes:

Thank you all for your suggestions and feedback thus far, and please keep it coming :) All your opinions are very important to us, as the primary goal of the show is to make you guys happy and make sure that you all enjoy it :thumbsup: So please, continue to send your feed back in :)

Julea and I are continually discussing some of the issues you guys have raised :) Nothing in depth yet, but that will all come after this finale week has wrapped up :)

The constant issue is the longevity of the competition, with a vast majority of you saying that you lose interest after the first 5 weeks or so, and don't pick up until the end.

This issue is something that Julea and I are working through. We plan to have to shorter seasons but make them more frequent. This will keep our competitions interesting and fun throughout the entire competition :)

As for the other issues you all have raised, we are and will continue to discuss the points which you've all brought up.

Continue to send in your feed back and good luck to our final three! :D

Phillip.

[Pippin's mom]

I just read this thread from first to last post(no skimming).:) This is great please keep your suggestions and ideas coming!:D

Louara~ "Save a Contestant" was something new we decided to give a try this season (got the idea from idol) however, it just didn't work in this format and IMO was a huge flop. As far as I'm concerned it is tossed!:)

I completely agree that the videos were disappointing..it is obvious when they are just thrown together instead of thought going into the production. Plus posting them after the fact took the fun and excitement out of them for me anyway. I would have done them if I would have had the time, but I just didn't and it's not what I signed on for.;)

I also agree about the deadlines..they need to be consistent. They were when I was producing the comp. on the Linnie forum and it was sooo nice!:)
Back up judges are really necessary.

Helen~ I agree about the MOTP thread being too cluttered..I even kind of lost interest in it for the very reasons you mention. It was confusing. I think a separate thread for comments and photos is best.

Having the two MOTP is fine and has worked well in previous competitions so I don't think that will be going away. It doesn't take any additional time away from the competition as they are chosen directly after the 2nd and 4th challenges and they are chosen by the producers. Of course this may change some what if we shorten the length of the competition.

I also do not care for the public voting along with or instead of judges. I can see several potential problems with this. I also don't agree that the most popular Budgie should win the competition. Every contestant puts a lot of time and work into the challenges and deserve to be judged on the merits of their photos not on their popularity.

I also think we need to rework our process in selecting judges.:) On the Linnie forum I kept the bias in check by selecting one member of the Linnie forum and two members from Talk Budgies who didn't know any of the members or their birds. That seemed to work well.:)

Corina~ You may have not seen my last post regarding your elimination in the other thread.:) You were not voted out because you used your Diva Card.

I will say though for those of you having trouble with the diva card..this is how it works with the real life competitions as well. As the competition progresses the judges expect more than at the beginning of the competition and the judges will even tell the contestants they need to step it up as they near the finale. I don't think this makes the competition or use of the diva card inconsistent. Growth is expected if one is expecting to remain in the competition. Using the diva card up to the finale is fine, but it is taking more of a risk the later it's used in the competition. It doesn't mean at all that if you do use it late in the competition that you automatically will be voted out. If your photo is judged better than others you will still be in even with a diva card. The criteria for judging remains the same through out the competition, but at some point the judging has to become more critical and has to change some or they would never be able to vote out anyone. Trust me judging this competition is not an easy task.

Please keep in mind that there was a lot going on behind the scenes that you were not privy to and we did the best we could under the circumstances. This season was a huge mess in my opinion, but I also know how great this competition is when it is managed properly. So yes, it was disorganized, but it certainly didn't start out that way. When you're supposed to have a team of five ( 2 producers and 3 judges) and it came down to just two of us for the majority of the competition of course it didn't run as smoothly and mistakes were made. We did the best we could and we did it for you. Believe me I cried real tears more than once during this competition and was at times ready to throw in the towel, but didn't for you.

So anyway..please keep the feedback coming in..I truly am thoughtfully reading each post and making notes.:)

[gpgilbert]

When I used the term "most popular," I did not mean a "popularity contest." I meant that I don't see anything wrong with the bird that people like the most to win the contest. One would assume that the best entry would be liked best and thus be most "popular."

[louara]

Julea,
I for one am so glad that you did not throw in the towel:) I think we, the contestants, all knew or felt that something was wrong but it did not show to the extent that you are describing. You did an amazing job considering you were for the most part on your own or with just one other person.
I am now volunteering for Season 10. Any help you need just let me know. I think a well-coordinated crew is what will solve most of the problems you had this season.
This is a great competition . Let's keep it alive:)

[Budgietom]

Julea,
I for one am so glad that you did not throw in the towel:) I think we, the contestants, all knew or felt that something was wrong but it did not show to the extent that you are describing. You did an amazing job considering you were for the most part on your own or with just one other person.
I am now volunteering for Season 10. Any help you need just let me know. I think a well-coordinated crew is what will solve most of the problems you had this season.
This is a great competition . Let's keep it alive:)

This season was rough in terms of commitment.

Julea did a fantastic job of keeping everything together during tough times, and always with our two fabulous judges Sue and Emily by her side :)

I was out for the middle part of the contest due to unexpected personal circumstances which I have discussed with Julea and Admin. Shandi unfortunately left early due to her very busy personal life.

We have a strong TBNTM crew, and we look out for eachother and are all doing our very best to ensure that you guys all have fun and enjoy the competition.

TBNTM is very much alive and will continue for seasons to come :)

[Cassidy]

i love it to stacey!! Also i want all birds!! Budgies, cockatiels, sun conures, love birds and every breed be able to do this because i onley have one REALLY tame bird and its not a parakeet but that is just what i think would be better also i dont think they should be soo looooooooooooooong

[AngelWings]

Philip, if we do have another TBTM all bird competition, can last season's birds participate? 'Cause you know Coacoa has been practicing and all he wants to try again to be a TBNTM just like his girlfriend Mochi.

[stacey101]

i love it to stacey!! Also i want all birds!! Budgies, cockatiels, sun conures, love birds and every breed be able to do this because i onley have one REALLY tame bird and its not a parakeet but that is just what i think would be better also i dont think they should be soo looooooooooooooong

we've had an all birds next top model before ;)

[Budgietom]

Philip, if we do have another TBTM all bird competition, can last season's birds participate? 'Cause you know Coacoa has been practicing and all he wants to try again to be a TBNTM just like his girlfriend Mochi.

Of course :) :)

[Cassidy]

we've had an all birds next top model before ;)

yes i know but i think it should come back becuase not everyone has a really tame budgie (me as well) and people may have wantted it to come back (me as well) :)

[Budgietom]

Our next competition will probably be All Bird's Next Top Model :thumbsup: Not 100% certain, but I'm pretty confident we will do all bird's next time round :)

[AngelWings]

Our next competition will probably be All Bird's Next Top Model :thumbsup: Not 100% certain, but I'm pretty confident we will do all bird's next time round :)

You're *sure* i can re enter this season right? after all i didn't get that far last season :p Coacoa is tamer now, i'd love to enter again :XD:

[Budgietom]

You're *sure* i can re enter this season right? after all i didn't get that far last season :p Coacoa is tamer now, i'd love to enter again :XD:

Not 100% sure.. this will depend on whether we allow staff to participate or not. If we do, then of course you can enter! :thumbsup:

[AngelWings]

Not 100% sure.. this will depend on whether we allow staff to participate or not. If we do, then of course you can enter! :thumbsup:

Ofcourse everyone would let staff participate! :D If they let Kim, ofcourse they'd let me right guys? right? ;)
I should start training to send in the most amazing entry picture! :eek: Coacoa needs to go to stright modelling camp, he has gained a couple of grams recently :XD:

[Budgietom]

Ofcourse everyone would let staff participate! :D If they let Kim, ofcourse they'd let me right guys? right? ;)
I should start training to send in the most amazing entry picture! :eek: Coacoa needs to go to stright modelling camp, he has gained a couple of grams recently :XD:

A COUPLE OF GRAMS!!?!?! :eek: That bird really needs to go on a diet! :p ;)

[Cassidy]

hahaha Leanna is working her tail off!!! She is gonna be a starrr :) lol!

[BudgieBC]

I've been reading this thread with considerable interest. The TBNTM contest, in spite of all the challenges, is a great idea which should continue.

I do wonder however, why we would have the critique before the contest is over. Wouldn't it be better to go with the plan, arrive at a decision as to contest winner and when it's over invite comments for the next time the contest is to be held? These lessons learned will only make each successive contest better.

Good luck to every one!

[atomshell]

I think that makes a lot of sense BudgieBC. Finish this one and then hash out new plans. LOL

[Pippin's mom]

I think that makes a lot of sense BudgieBC. Finish this one and then hash out new plans. LOL

I agree as well!:) As stated before we most likely will have an All Bird NTM, but it definitely won't be until after the first of the year. Everyone is ready for a much needed break and there are some Holiday contests in the works as we speak..so yes, let's get this one wrapped up before we worry about the next one.:)

[Budgietom]

I agree as well!:) As stated before we most likely will have an All Bird NTM, but it definitely won't be until after the first of the year. Everyone is ready for a much needed break and there are some Holiday contests in the works as we speak..so yes, let's get this one wrapped up before we worry about the next one.:)

:thumbsup: My thoughts exactly.

[riotfox]

cool, all birds would be cool! there should be an all pets one!

i disagree with the motp being too cluttered, making seperate threads would make it more difficult. i reckon people would be much less likely to bother leaving comments if they have to go to another thread first. if anything there should be less different threads.

[Pippin's mom]

cool, all birds would be cool! there should be an all pets one!

i disagree with the motp being too cluttered, making seperate threads would make it more difficult. i reckon people would be much less likely to bother leaving comments if they have to go to another thread first. if anything there should be less different threads.

I agree another thread for comments may not be the way to go, but it was way too cluttered and it did become a bit confusing so something different needs to happen. I'm thinking a weekly thread for MOTP. I think it will help out a lot not having all nine weeks crammed into a single thread...same for the weekly bloopers.

[gpgilbert]

I agree another thread for comments may not be the way to go, but it was way too cluttered and it did become a bit confusing so something different needs to happen. I'm thinking a weekly thread for MOTP. I think it will help out a lot not having all nine weeks crammed into a single thread...same for the weekly bloopers.


That's a great idea. It will make it much easier to follow if there are separate ones each week just like the contestants' threads.

[riotfox]

yeah that sounds alright. personally i think its fine as is but a weekly thread would not be bad either. ti make things easier i think the judges should comment directly in the official photo threads. that way they dont have to quote the pictures in the feedback thread and it makes it easy to read if it is split by week with the photos. there shouldnt be a problem with it getting cluttered since there is only a few photos in the thread anyways.

[Rachel Keeth]

I just watched all of session four and it was great! Layla is not tame enough to do anything like that but if there is going to be another NTM in the future when I have another budgie that is tame I would love to participate!

[louara]

Hi Rachel,
The staff has been discussing the possiblilty of having another NTM contest. Stay tuned to this Forum for updates :)

[Corina]

I just watched all of session four and it was great! Layla is not tame enough to do anything like that but if there is going to be another NTM in the future when I have another budgie that is tame I would love to participate!

Your budgie doesn't have to be tame at all. Kenji is not a tame budgie all I did in the contest was build up the sets and get him to be comfortable in them :)

[Rachel Keeth]

Thank you!

I will try that, she doesn't like new thing and never has so I'm not sure how long it would take but I want to try!