Megabacteria - what to do?

[homebird]

A member recently lost most of her flock to this killer - such a terrible thing - & i felt that this topic is very important.
I have seen many people [here too] who have lost a bird they just got & didn't know what to do & didn't take the bird in to get an evaluation by the Vet & so will never know.

Please feel free to add to this thread with any info.

Here are some links to medicines:

Bird Biotic (Doxycycline)
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=5059+5992+12269&pcatid=12269

* Non-prescription antibiotic for birds
* Ideal for non-specific bacterial infections
Broad range Doxycycline Hyclate is an antibiotic that can be used for non-specific systemic and local infections in pet birds. Add the contents of one capsule to 8 ounces of drinking water. Make a fresh solution daily. Continue treatment for 7 - 10 days. 100 count.


MEGABAC-S = http://www.stuff4birds.com/mega.html
Target Species:
All avian species susceptible to Megabacteria.

Availability
Powder: 25g, 40g

....
Other Applications
Effective against other yeast and fungal infections of the gastrointestinal system ( e.g.: Candida ).



Article on Megabacteria http://shadypines.com/megabact.htm
....

He describes symptoms of budgerigars in the acute stage to include severe drowsiness, lethargy, fluffed feathers - ending with death within 12 - 24 hours. Regurgitated blood can stain the feathers around the beak and neck. This same bleeding may result in droppings that are black or reddish-black. The chronic stage is more common, and is usually seen in budgerigars over one year of age, or just after the first breeding season. These birds become depressed, lose condition, fluff up and lose weight in spite of their apparent good appetites. Although the birds are often at the food dish, they only grind or mouth their foods, swallowing very little. Birds may regurgitate blood tinged food. They may "mouth gag" or "neck stretch" in an attempt to regurgitate. Their droppings may contain undigested seed particles, or even undigested whole seeds. These budgies will continue to lose weight over weeks or even months, then they either die or slowly recover. He cautions that what may appear to be a recovered bird will usually relapse later when stressed, naming molting or breeding as examples of stress. He also advises that these birds are of no value in a breeding program.

...

[BUUZBEE]

I'm glad you posted... i was googling a lot on this yesterday after the topic was brought up and didnt get a chance to post. I will make this a sticky.

[homebird]

Thank you.

On another board a respected bird person wrote this & I'd like to post it:

The first symptom of megabacteria (which is a fungal infection and not bacterial at all) is weight loss. If a bird starts losing weight and does not have any other obvious symptom for it, the best thing is to put him on an antifungal.

Megabacteria comes, mostly, from unsanitary situations: dirty cages, cages without a bottom grid where birds forage among their own poop, bedding not changed regularly, bowls made of plastic instead of steel, that kind of thing.

It's contagious in that it can spread through fecal matter (that's why the bottom grid is so important).

[Pippin's mom]

Thank you for posting this Homebird!:) Bye~Bye plastic dishes!

[Kip.The.Great]

When your saying that the bottom grid is important, i just removed mine. I recently lost my lovebird, we believed her leg got stuck in the bottom grid. I don't want to risk it again, and don't want to risk this diesease. Will my babies be alright if i clean the cage out every day? I really don't want to put the grids back in there. :S

[homebird]

I would think that if you keep the cage clean & the 'plastic' bowls too [I wash with a good dose of Organic Apple Cider Vinegar] everything will be OK. In fact I wash out the water dispenser as well with apple cider [although it does have yeast in it - it is a good product] & put some in their water as well.

Some links to OACV
http://hubpages.com/hub/Ten_Good_Resons_To_Give_Your_Pet_Apple_Cider_Vineg ar
&
http://naturalbird.com/mcwatters/acv_for_birds.htm
What are the nutritional benefits of ACV?

Many vitamins, minerals and other nutrients and substances are available in ACV to improve the health of your bird. ....

Other benefits of ACV…

ACV has the ability to prevent the growth of bacteria and mold;therefore, adding it to your bird’s fresh foods as a nutritional supplement has an additional purpose. The acid content of ACV will help reduce the chance of bacterial or fungal growth on fresh foods during the period of time they are in your bird’s food bowl.

....
The dosage I use is 1/4 tsp. for small parrots and 1/2 tsp. for medium-large parrots. It can also be given orally diluted in water under the guidance of a vet or avian health practitioner.

...The author asks that we not copy this article - hope this isn't too against the rules! - but I know many just want the short version.


I think this very well informed person is referring to the birds that walk on the cage bottoms & can get dirt on their feet. Even outside of the cage I've seen my birds step into their own moist poo & then have to clean their foot. I've also read a number of threads that say 'My bird eats Poop! - what can I do?'.

I too have had to rethink how often I clean the cages. I, like so many, cleaned them every day at first & now only a couple of times a week! I know I am lazy - but the perch areas where they hang most of the time I clean a few times a day.

[Pippin's mom]

So my plastic dishes should be fine then if I'm cleaning them out with ACv? I clean them a few times a week with ACv..guess I should do it every day? I also put a drop or two of ACv in ther water daily.

My capital v isn't working for some reason.

[Deuce81]

Thats very good info. I am going to have to go get some Apple Cider Vinegar.

[aka.pody]

Thank you Homebird. We lost our Blue to megabacteria two years ago. Thankfully her cage companion was ok.
It's a devastating illness. We all know how they hide their illnesses. So when the disease is full-blown and they start to show signs of illness it's sadly too late.
It gets to where their little bodies simply can't fight any more.
I came to find out that some birds are carriers. They are actually born with it; being passed on from the mother who was a carrier. It can lie dormant for years and suddenly one day your little one is deathly ill.
Perhaps by simply reading your post one more little life will be saved.
Thank you again.

[Cannuck]

Thank you Homebird for posting this! I have the grids and change the paper in my cages daily, however only do a complete cage wash once a week. I also have plastic dishes primarily. This has been a learning experience for me.
Thank you for the links, I am still sifting through them but am learning a lot.

[homebird]

Thank you Homebird. We lost our Blue to megabacteria two years ago. Thankfully her cage companion was ok.
It's a devastating illness. We all know how they hide their illnesses. So when the disease is full-blown and they start to show signs of illness it's sadly too late.
It gets to where their little bodies simply can't fight any more.
I came to find out that some birds are carriers. They are actually born with it; being passed on from the mother who was a carrier. It can lie dormant for years and suddenly one day your little one is deathly ill.
Perhaps by simply reading your post one more little life will be saved.
Thank you again.

I was also surprised about the hidden nature of this ailment. It really worries me. When people get rid of their Budgies when they move on to bigger Parrots it can be because of this. I used to think they were being selfish.

It says in one of the studies that even when a bird recovers they make poor parents as the stress of parenting can bring it back. How sad. I didn't know they could pass it on, but it makes sense as they feed them & in doing that they contaminate the babies.

I'm sorry to hear you too lost a bird. I look at mine & know I'd be devastated to loose either one. I have already improved my cleaning routine.

Thanks to Cannuck - her dedication to her birds & her recent loss is why I have taken this so seriously & asked for help. All the info here was given to me by very caring & educated Parrot people.

[aka.pody]

Thank you Homebird. I still think about Blue.
At the time we didn't know anything about this disease. The vet said that more times than not it's born into them from the mother being the carrier. Another way they can get it is just being in contact with a sick bird or one that was a carrier when you bought it. You choose one bird out of ten, but you don't know if any of the other birds already had the disease. He was a healthy bird for three years. I trusted what the vet was telling us since he's an accredited avian specialist. We never suspected him to be sick. He was playing and eating as usual than suddenly he became very ill. The vet said at the onset that it didn't look good and most birds don't survive.

Sadly it took a tragedy like Cannuck endured to put this information out there.
All the members need to read about it. A clean cage is always very important. But sometimes things happen that are simply out of your hands.
Love your little friends, and never forget that they can be taken away at any time through no fault of your own.

[Kerry C]

If you go to the BAA web site http://www.budgerigarassociation.com and click on the Articles button David N. Phalen, DVM, PhD, Dipl. ABVP (Avian) did a write up on "megabacteria" and the effective drug use to kill it. Also Dr. Phalen is the vet who did the break through research to discover that this is really a yeast and NOT a bacteria. The name of this yeast is now officially, Macrorhabdus ornithogaster (MO)

[navim234]

From this site I learned a lot about budgies.

http://www.birds-online.de/gesundheit/gesinfektion/gls_en.htm

[LauraBeth]

:( I think this is what Yellow had.
Yellow would have died with in the week I got her if I hadn't on a whim decided to take her to the vet 'cause the pet store gave me a referral and a free check up (but that didn't include all the tests cost, which was like a hundred bucks) but Yellow only cost about 10 so it's not that bad for a new family member that could be with you potentially 10-20 years;)

It's so sad:(
And we treated it with some kinda anti fungal stuff That I fed her in a syringe for 30 days. I'm not sure what the medicine was sorry - but it was pretty cheap. But It worked. And the vet was very very un-optimistic about her chances.
and Yellow got better!

If it's the same thing: When I took Captain to the vet when I got him I requested the test - He wasn't underweight or anything but I wanted to make sure he didn't have it. And the vet said it was a good Idea.
He said that he's the vet for PetCo (where I got him) And they routinely check for the bacteria infections and the keep the birds that get them there for treatment.

He also said that a lot of birds don't get sick they just carry it
So that is also why the test is a good thing because you don't want your bird that is not sick just a carrier to pass it on to others so You still treat the bird.

he told me that when a bird has it they are ussually underweight but eating A LOT.
He said that is how he was pretty certain before even doing the test that Yellow had it.
because she was eating Millet during the examination with NO FEAR and eating and eating and all happy but she was so skinny. But whatever meds He prescribed worked thank God.

p.s. The other symptom Yellow had was Poop was sticking all on her bum. But that might have been 'cause she wasn't feeling good and not taking care of it. But she was keeping herself all clean besides so i don't know.

anyways I'm probably not talking about the same thing - but I think I am;)

[Cannuck]

:( I think this is what Yellow had.
Yellow would have died with in the week I got her if I hadn't on a whim decided to take her to the vet 'cause the pet store gave me a referral and a free check up (but that didn't include all the tests cost, which was like a hundred bucks) but Yellow only cost about 10 so it's not that bad for a new family member that could be with you potentially 10-20 years;)

It's so sad:(
And we treated it with some kinda anti fungal stuff That I fed her in a syringe for 30 days. I'm not sure what the medicine was sorry - but it was pretty cheap. But It worked. And the vet was very very un-optimistic about her chances.
and Yellow got better!

If it's the same thing: When I took Captain to the vet when I got him I requested the test - He wasn't underweight or anything but I wanted to make sure he didn't have it. And the vet said it was a good Idea.
He said that he's the vet for PetCo (where I got him) And they routinely check for the bacteria infections and the keep the birds that get them there for treatment.

He also said that a lot of birds don't get sick they just carry it
So that is also why the test is a good thing because you don't want your bird that is not sick just a carrier to pass it on to others so You still treat the bird.

he told me that when a bird has it they are ussually underweight but eating A LOT.
He said that is how he was pretty certain before even doing the test that Yellow had it.
because she was eating Millet during the examination with NO FEAR and eating and eating and all happy but she was so skinny. But whatever meds He prescribed worked thank God.

p.s. The other symptom Yellow had was Poop was sticking all on her bum. But that might have been 'cause she wasn't feeling good and not taking care of it. But she was keeping herself all clean besides so i don't know.

anyways I'm probably not talking about the same thing - but I think I am;)


It does sound similiar. ButterCup was always on the small side, but she did eat well. I had always tacked it down as her having been outdoors for a while. It really made me super cautious when it came to quarantine, minimum 60 days instead of 30. It was a tradgedy, but we all learned a lot from it. I miss those budgies terribly, especially Trident.

[Gooney Bird]

Cosmo has just been diagnosed with Avian Gastric Yeast, again! He also has bacterial colitis.

Two years ago he became very sick, lost weight rapidly. The vet said he had a bacterial infection in his crop. He was given oral antibiotics and a month later came down with AGY.

The only drug known to treat AGY or megabacteria is Aphateracin B. It is only available by prescription. Here in the Seattle area, the vets don't stock it. They fax the scrip to a special pharmacy that will compound the medicine as needed.

So anyway, Cosmo was treated for a month and seemed to be better, than 2 months later he was sick again. I gave him another course of Amphateracin B for 30 days.

This is a very tricky, hard to treat yeast. It is almost always fatal in cockatiels. If you have budgies with AGY, keep them away from your 'tiels!

I am actually surprised Cosmo has lived as long as he has. Some of things I credit are:

prompt veterinary care from an avian specialist
apple cider vinegar in his water; 1/4 cup to a quart of water
full spectrum lighting
pelleted diet; Harrison's fine
fresh food daily; broccoli, carrot, apple, sweet potato, etc
Benebac (acidophiles)
Prozyme (digestive enzymes)
clean dishes daily
clean paper daily
lots of toys and exercise
lots of love and prayers

He is being treated for the bacterial infection, the compunded drug won't be ready until the end of the week.

[Cannuck]

Cosmo has just been diagnosed with Avian Gastric Yeast, again! He also has bacterial colitis.

Two years ago he became very sick, lost weight rapidly. The vet said he had a bacterial infection in his crop. He was given oral antibiotics and a month later came down with AGY.

The only drug known to treat AGY or megabacteria is Aphateracin B. It is only available by prescription. Here in the Seattle area, the vets don't stock it. They fax the scrip to a special pharmacy that will compound the medicine as needed.

So anyway, Cosmo was treated for a month and seemed to be better, than 2 months later he was sick again. I gave him another course of Amphateracin B for 30 days.

This is a very tricky, hard to treat yeast. It is almost always fatal in cockatiels. If you have budgies with AGY, keep them away from your 'tiels!

I am actually surprised Cosmo has lived as long as he has. Some of things I credit are:

prompt veterinary care from an avian specialist
apple cider vinegar in his water; 1/4 cup to a quart of water
full spectrum lighting
pelleted diet; Harrison's fine
fresh food daily; broccoli, carrot, apple, sweet potato, etc
Benebac (acidophiles)
Prozyme (digestive enzymes)
clean dishes daily
clean paper daily
lots of toys and exercise
lots of love and prayers

He is being treated for the bacterial infection, the compunded drug won't be ready until the end of the week.


Another thing you can do is reduce the amount of sugar (even natural sugars) as it helps the infection (yeast) to grow.

[Gooney Bird]

Cosmo died today of Avian Gastric Yeast and pseudomonas.

[ronsig]

Cosmo died today of Avian Gastric Yeast and pseudomonas.

I am so sorry. I only saw this now when I was looking for some information.
I found your previous post so helpful, and then I found this:(
My condolences. I am sorry this was overlooked for so long.

My question about GLS was: Are budgies with GLS doing better on pellets without any seeds?
Does anybody know the answer?

Sigrid

[missmadison]

Another addition is that if you use metal dishes, be sure they are for birds and/or are zinc free. We are building a small aviary/large cage for our finches and I've been reading up on galvanized metal, etc. and have discovered zinc is in more things than I realized!

Great information by the way...thanks for posting it.

[Jordan S.]

This makes me so mad, If only I had know about this when my flock got sick with what I suspect was a infection of some sort.

[Coral]

Almost all of the big breeders here have flocks infected with megabac, but the birds seem to have a better resistance to it than your birds, because they are able to breed and carry on without showing any signs of it.

I lost three birds 2 months ago to megabac - I got them to the vet, but they did not make it. I now give them a preventative treatment every 2 months. My vet says that it keeps the megabac numbers down, but rarely wipes them out. I can't remember what it is called at the moment.

My sincere condolences to everyone that has lost birds :(

[ozzie]

He describes symptoms of budgerigars in the acute stage to include severe drowsiness, lethargy, fluffed feathers - ending with death within 12 - 24 hours. .......................... These budgies will continue to lose weight over weeks or even months, then they either die or slowly recover.


I'm so confused that part did not make sense to me....first they die within 12-24 hours then it make take weeks or months to die or recover???

[Caradow]

I lost Coco last year to Megabacteria. She was one of those where is goes real fast. we never suspected she was ill.
Now Ukkie is recovering from it. After one month of Amphoteracine B, he is free of Megabacteria, but still nog well.
Amphoteracine B is really nasty stuff, when humans or cats and dogs are treated with these medication, regular checkups on liver and kidneys are performed. On our little budgies this is not possible, since a weak budgie should not be taken blood from.

ACV can help preventing a Megabacteria outbreak, but is not guaranteed.

Preventative treatment on regular basis with Amphoteracine B is not recommended, cause of the problems that can be caused to liver and kidneys.

Megabacteria is most likely to strike when resistance level of the budgie is down, for example when budgies molting or when there is another infection present.

There is still a lot not known about this disease, where is came from, how to prevent.

My vet told me, not to buy any budgies at petstores atm, it seems that many many young budgies in the stores are infected atm. It is not guaranteed that breeders dont have sick birds, but one sick bird at the shop, wil infect all other birds there...

[fullmetalgirl]

Hey guys,

heres my questio:
they did a lot of research here in holland about mega bacteria..
they say: it's a fungus not bacteria.
this is also the reason why Amphotericin B shows good effects (an anti-fungus medicine)

A fungus is not really contaiges...
here they say most birds already have it... but it doesn play unless there is poor food/health hygiene issue..

so my question: is it true or false wether it is contaiges or not?

Did any one read a vet artikel about it?
my story came from a vet in holland who studied megabacteria.